Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

[QUOTE=stuntincbr600rr]i ride on 04 cbr 600rr granted i know that it is not a stunt bike by far but i was wondering if anyone had any tips on this underpowered bike i had to change the stock sprockets to get it to lift i went one down in the front and 3 up in the rear dont get me wrong it will come up but i need some advice on rocking a 2nd gear stand up should i clutch if so how and at what rpm should i put the left foot back should i power it up if so how to bounce and at how fast or rpm

Matt[/QUOTE]

Can't read that

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way.
 

[QUOTE=f4rider]You're thinking too hard... or maybe not hard enough :shruggs :laughing.
Try standing on a hand rail snow-board style. What do you do when you start falling backwards? You arch your back, lean back, and swing your arms like you're doing the back stroke. And when you start falling forward, you lean forward, stick your ass out, and swing your arms the opposite way.

Now that we've disproved your physics theorems; that has nothing to do with balancing slow wheelies side to side. Wheelies are not balanced by the change of weight distribution, but by turning the rear wheel into the direction that the bike is falling. When the bike is in the wheelie position, the rear wheel is turned by twisting the bike. The force which causes you to lean (pushing with one hand, pulling with the other) is the same force which twists the bike while it’s on the rear wheel.

Now go outside and grab your BMX or mountain bike and prove this for yourself.[/QUOTE]

actually when i lose balance on a rail or pipe or whatever (i happen to freestyle skate and rollerblade AND snowboard) i do the opposite of what you said, maybe it's just me but when i'm about to fall forward i don't stick my ass out in the other direction i stick my crotch forward and lean my upper body back.......it works for me, but like i said maybe it's just ME, and i borrowed my little brother's dyno bmx and when i started leaning to one side i caught myself leaning to the other, so it's probably just me, otherwise all your info is great i printed it out and gave it to my cousin cause he was wanting to learn wheelies and i wasn't sure what to tell him, thanks again :cheers

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

[QUOTE=f4rider]Can't read that[/QUOTE]

Probably because theres no punctuation anywhere. I'm going to try my decoder ring on it....

[QUOTE=stuntincbr600rr]I ride on 04 cbr 600rr - granted, i know that it is not a stunt bike by far, but i was wondering if anyone had any tips on this underpowered bike?

I had to change the stock sprockets to get it to lift. I went -1 in the front and +3 in the rear. Dont get me wrong, it will come up, but i need some advice on rocking a 2nd gear stand up. Should i clutch? If so, how and at what rpm should i put the left foot back? Should i power it up? If so how? Do I bounce and at how fast or what rpm?"[/QUOTE]

And I think the answer is, read the first page in the thread for some good info. All of it.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

Ok I can power em up in first but kinda unpridictable and jumps up quick so I close the throttle and let it back down. So I was trying clutching it today..

Was in 2nd around 30-40 and at around 6000-6500 rpm.. I left the throttle in position and pulled the clutch to engage it and let it out in one quick motion the bike just lunges a bit forward. :shruggs

What do I need to do? Bike is 929 with -1/+2 sprocket setup.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

when you pull the clutch in you have to give it more gas... if you're at 6500 I'd say crack the throttle up to like 8 and it should come up. I'm about the farthest thing from a pro... just thought I'd chime in with my :2cents

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

nice write up

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

I think it's easier for me at least to roll on the throttle first and then slip the clutch while you're accelerating. When you roll off the throttle, and slip the clutch it's less predictable because you might add too much throttle or not enough after you dump it.

Not to mention the fact that when you're accelerating the front end is lighter which makes it easier to get up.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

By letting off the throttle you load the front forks causing a springing action, it helps a lot with underpowered bikes. kind of like a free bounce without you having to move. :fiddy

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

Sorry if I don't understand this concept I'm not trying to be arrogant or anything but when you clutch it and the forks are compressed doesn't this just waste power on extending the forks? Kind of like when you do a stoppie you wanna get the forks compressed before you brake hard so all your power goes straight to the ground.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

To the best of my knowledge, and I am about as far from a pro as you can be. When you bounce a wheelie, you are compressing the forks and using the spring they give to help with the power of the engine to push the bike up. thus when releasing the throttle and doing so you get a free bounce without actually bouncing it. it's the same as when you power wheelie... you go, let of the gas real quick then whack it again... when you let you, you compressed the forks. no different when clutching.

When doing stoppies, the reason you compress the forks first is so that all the weight transfers from the suspension to the tire... leaving the rear momentum nowhere to go but up, thus lifting the wheel.

I may be way wrong. but thats my understanding. Feel free to correct me on any of this.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

I can stand it up in first - but I cant get it up at all in 2nd or 3rd. I'm trying both clutch methods, which, in 1st, is pulled in/slipped around 3-4k (15-25) and dropped at about 6-8, and it stands up. I CANT DO THIS AT ALL in 2nd or 3rd... trying all different speeds/rpms. It wont lift an inch. Sitting up straight, a** back in the seat, no weight on the bars. Basically the engine just bogs down and lugs to catch up with the throttle. What the fu*k? Any help would be appreciated... Suzuki rf9 +2rear

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

hey man that was some good info
i notice that you mention hondas and gsxr's i have a kawasaki 636
is this a stunt bike and if it is what tips can you giv me :hello

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

[QUOTE=kawa636]i have a kawasaki 636
is this a stunt bike and if it is what tips can you giv me :hello[/QUOTE]

There is no such thing as a stunt bike. Some motorcycles are just a little better at crashing and being on one wheel than others. From what i've read about 636's, they are great for stunting, but you will want to put on stronger pegs and clipons besides the normal bar, cage, and damper. PM Teach; he's got the hookup on 636 stuff.

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

Got some new tips for beginners on clutching up wheelies. This worked for me in getting the launches consistant.
Don't do the rev high then dump routine - use the clutch to get the front end up the first 2-3 feet. While the front end is still on its way up and the clutch is all the way out, gas it a bit more and you can raise the front as high as you dare.
I was trying to get the front up to BP by dialling in accurate amount of revs and using just the right clutch release speed - it's too difficult to get that method right every time. On a 919CBr I can get the front lifted on real low (quarter throttle) revs using the clutch up to 2-3 feet then gas sit up the rest of the way. This is also a good time to shift, while the front has got some upward momentum - shifting at height is a good way to loop if your'e still learning!
The most useful thing I learnt was -practice on a really long bit of road. I wasted a year practicing in a too short roadway, keep your mind on the wheelie and you'll learn faster without distractions of kerbs/junctions/walls at the end of your braking zone.

If anyones got any more details like these (the steering by twisting tip was excellent) keep posting!

Figured it Out Last Night
 

After countless hours reading post after post here on stunt life about the wheelie and about a month of practicing i finally figured out how to bring that front end up with ease last night! I ride an 03 r6 with -1 in the front and my biggest problem for the past month was i could bring it up consistently about a foot but nothing more. I kept getting frustrated since everyone that i ride with was figuring them out and then suddenly it came to me. Now i getting rolling about 4 grand in 1st gear. Pull the clutch in and roll throttle and dump the clutch and it will come up. THe problem i was having for the past month was not holding the clutch in long enough. I pull the clutch in and say "one" (dont know where it came from but works) and thats all the time you need. before i was just slipping the clutch and letting it out. ALso when i give it gas i get the rpms to about 6.5 grand. Its not a lot of gas but that thing will come right up. and in one night i went from not wheeling to riding a few about 30 ft. Basically if you are having trouble keep practicing. it took me a month of riding 3-4 nights a week for an hour a night to finally figure it out. but once you figure it out its money. Also lower your tire pressure. I put mine at 25 and a hell of alot easier.

Another helpful hint is dont twist the throttle with your hand. Try holding the throttle and thrusting down with your wrist. If your not getting enough throttle just adjuct your grip a little bit more throttle and then flick your wrist again. This helped me because i was never worried about looping it since you can only twist your wrist so much, but you can loop it if you just grab the throttle and twist with the palm of your hand... hopefully that makes sense. it does to me :)

Makes sense 2 me
 

First of all man, thanx for takin the time 2 share what u know. I just started riding 2 monthes ago, and I got a 600 Katana. Ive drivin other bikes and I just dont have much power. Im gonna give this stuff a shot and see if I can make sumthin happen. Thanx

Re: Makes sense 2 me
 

katanas are heavy

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

hey guys. I ride a 2003 SV1000S and have been stunting it out. I got a stage 2 kit from thrust company, and am about to get a crash cage and a 12 bar. Anyone else ride an SV1000 that can give me some trick tips? I am still working on clutching in second, but with the v-twin... i have no problem riding it out in 1st. I just want to learn to wheelie at slower speeds, so i can stand and not piss myself when it gets a lil shakey. Any tips would be greatly appreciated. :YEAH

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way
 

[QUOTE=lunglung]Im just learning to wheelie i can get it up on power but haven't learned how to ride it out yet. But on the clutch wheelies if im riding my 999s when i pull in the the clutch and close the throttle, when im on the throttle again what rpm should i be aiming for before i dump the clutch?[/QUOTE]

for clutch wheelies i have a gsx-r 600 so usually 2nd gear round 35.. I use my middle finger and this is just enough 2 get to the slipping point. 9k usually does it for me. cover the break incase you got 2 much throttle

Re: Complete guide for learning basic wheelies the right way.
 

[QUOTE=f4rider]First of all, I learned all of this from my own experience and from the advice of others on this forum. Following this advice wonÂ’t keep you from crashing, getting hurt, and breaking stuff; but it will, most likely, help you learn faster while crashing less often than if you figure everything out on your own.

Bike setup for wheelies

Oil: Many bikes will become oil starved when riding long wheelies, and doing 12 o-clock wheelies. Gixxers and cbr 900s ('93-'95 893cc model) are the most notorious for this. To keep the bike from becoming oil starved, either move the oil pickup in the oil pan back, or overfill the oil. Myself and some others on this forum run 1 quart over. Overfilling doesn't seem to cause any problems with hondas, but I have read of problems with gixxers as a result of this. So the best thing for a gixxer would probably be to fix the oil pickup. You can buy modified oil pickups for gixxers from [url]www.stuntex.com[/url] .

Gears: For learning, gearing the bike down is unnecessary. Almost every sportbike will wheelie in first gear without any problem (maybe the ex250 is an exception). Also gearing to make second gear come up easier is kind of pointless because it just becomes more like first gear with big sprockets. If it doesnÂ’t wheelie in first gear, it isnÂ’t the bikeÂ’s fault. For the most part, gears are unnecessary until you are ready to learn highchairs (on a weak 600), no throttle hand wheelies, and circles.

Tires: When doing high-speed wheelies make sure you have a good rear tire. A tire with a flat spot in the middle can cause wobbles. I learned wheelies on a rear tire that was almost down to the cords in the middle, and it would often wobble like crazy when doing balance point wheelies. A new tire almost completely eliminated that problem. Run the tire pressure lower than stock. For doing wheelies above 20 mph, have the tire pressure between 20 and 30psi. For doing wheelies slower than 20 mph, lower the pressure to between 12 and 20. 18-20 psi makes for a good all around psi. Lower tire pressure makes the wheelie more stable from side to side.

Tip over sensor: Most (or all, IÂ’m not sure) bikes with fuel injection have a tip over sensor. This can cause the bike to shut off when riding wheelies high. This should be disabled. For Hondas this can be done by cutting the wires going into the sensor, connecting the two outer wires, and leaving the middle one hanging. For gixxers, that method doesnÂ’t work. The brass ring in the sensor must be removed, or immobilized with something such as silicone.

Steering Damper: While it isnÂ’t imperative that you have a steering damper for doing wheelies, it might save your ass. If you come down from a wheelie with the front wheel crooked, it could cause a tank slapper. This shouldnÂ’t be a problem, though; if you make sure the front wheel is strait when you put it down.

Exhaust pipe: If learning 12s, the pipe may have to be shortened. The stock pipes on some bikes touch the ground at about the same time as the tail when doing a 12 o-clock wheelie. If the pipe hits the ground, it may cause you to crash. My friend just went down a week ago because of this. The pipe can be shortened by simply cutting a few inches off the end of the pipe, and then re-welding / re-riveting the end of the pipe back on. Short pipes can also be bought from [url]www.starboyz.com[/url].

Cage: In the process of learning to ride wheelies good, you will most likely drop your bike. Crash cages provide the best protection. All of these cages will most likely save you a lot of money if you crash, but none of them will completely protect your bike in every crash. Here is a list of some crash cage websites in no particular order.
MXD cages [url]http://eclipsebusiness.net/mxdcages.com/[/url]
Racing 905 Cages [url]http://www.racing905.com[/url]
Powers Cages [url]http://www.powersbikeworx.com/[/url]
Freestyle Ingenuity Cages [url]http://www.freestyleingenuity.com/[/url]
Wicked Crew Extreme Team's Cages [url]http://cantcuffus.com/cages_pics.htm[/url]

12 bar: Install a 12 bar if you plan on learning 12s. There was some debate as to whether or not to learn 12s with a 12 bar. I learned 12s with a bar and didnÂ’t have any problems. You just need to be more careful because a bar is less forgiving than plastic. However, I think tail sections cost way too much to smash on purpose. You can buy 12 bars from Racing 905 or Freestyle Ingenuity. They are also pretty simple to build yourself, at a fraction of the cost.

Protection: Wear a helmet, jacket, jeans, and gloves if you donÂ’t want to get messed up.


Before riding wheelies on a bike
If you have access to a quad, a dirt bike, or a fiddy, learn wheelies on that first. What you learn about throttle control and the balance point will help you in learning to ride a wheelie on a bike. If youÂ’re ready to learn on a bike then: 1. Make sure the rear brake works and adjust the lever to a comfortable height. 2. There should be 1in. of play in chain slack. A chain too tight or too loose will wear out the chain and sprockets faster than normal. 3. Make sure there are no cracks in the foot pegs, and make sure all of the bolts are tight.

Speed and riding position for learning wheelies
I recommend that beginners learn wheelies if first gear. It is easier to launch the wheelie in first gear, and there is more engine breaking in first gear. This means that you can ride a wheelie higher without the danger of looping it. It also hurts much less and breaks less stuff when you crash in first gear. For that reason i don't think it is a good idea to do highspeed wheelies until using the brake is second nature. It is also much easier to go from riding out first gear wheelies to second gear wheelies than vice versa. The only downfall to learning wheelies in first vs. seconds is that the wheelie wonÂ’t be as smooth. The throttle will feel much more sensitive. I think fifteen mph is a good speed to launch wheelies while learning; any slower and the wheelie may feel unstable to a beginner. I also recommend learning wheelies standing up with the left foot on the passenger peg, and the right foot on the front peg, covering the brake. While it may feel awkward at first to wheelie while standing, it will be easier after you get used to that part. Most people think it is easier to balance and control a wheelie standing up vs. sitting down. It is also easier to launch the wheelie from standing up.

Why clutching wheelies is the best method for launching wheelies
Clutching is by far the best way to get wheelies up, regardless of whether the bike has enough power to power it up. While it does wear out clutch plates a little faster than normal, the difference is not significant. I also have never read about any major problems as the result of the extra tension on the drive train. There are many advantages to clutching wheelies vs. powering wheelies. 1. It allows you to wheelie bikes that donÂ’t have enough power to power it up. 2. You can wheelie at lower rpmÂ’s, and therefore slower speeds. This allows beginners to keep a wheelie up longer, with out being at the balance point. 3. The launch is more predictable. When powering a wheelie up, the front end comes up relatively slow. Then when the front end is about 3 feet off the ground, the front end jumps up very fast under full throttle, making for a scary and unpredictable launch. When clutching up wheelies right, the front jumps up close to the balance point. From there you just play with the throttle to fine adjust the height. After a little practice, clutching becomes very predictable and not frightening at all. 4. All of the pros that I know of clutch every wheelie. You want to be like them donÂ’t you? :)

How to clutch wheelies
There are a couple different methods for clutching wheelies. I prefer the second method.
Method 1: First accelerate with the clutch engaged. Then, with the throttle still opened, pull in the clutch with one finger, to the point where the clutch disengages. With the engine still under throttle, quickly let the clutch back out as the tach is rising.
Method 2: Close the throttle, and then pull the clutch in all the way, with one finger. Then twist the throttle and dump the clutch.
When learning to clutch, only rev up the engine a little bit at first before letting out the clutch. This will give you the feel for clutching. Then gradually increase the rpmÂ’s before dumping the clutch, until the front end jumps up close to the balance point. Reduce the throttle as the front end comes up to the balance point. If it comes up too far, gently push the rear brake to bring the bike back forward. When clutching second and third gear wheelies, the bike may need extra help, depending on what bike it is. If clutching alone doesnÂ’t get the wheelie up, then bounce at the same time. This is done by pushing down on the bike (with your arms and legs) at the same time you open the throttle, and then leaning back slightly when dropping the clutch. I is not a good idea to pull on the bars. Pulling up on the bars may cause the wheelie to come up funny and wobble.


Shifting gears
I donÂ’t recommend shifting gears during a wheelie unless you are good at wheelies, and are able to use the clutch in the process. Otherwise, shifting during wheelies is hard on the transmission. It is also hard on the fork seals if you miss a shift. My advice is to learn to ride wheelies at a constant speed. Then there will be no need to shift.


How to set a wheelie down
When bringing down a wheelie, stay on the throttle until the front end is safely on the ground. If it is necessary to quickly bring down the front end, then close the throttle at first. Then as the front is coming down, open the throttle. In that way you will have a soft landing.

Step by step procedure to launch a wheelie for a beginner
1. Drop the tire pressure to about 15-20psi
2. Put the bike into first gear
3. Go about 15mph
4. Pull in the clutch
5. Rev up the engine a little and drop the clutch
6. Repeat step 5, increasing the rpmÂ’s, until the front end comes up close to the balance point.
7. Reduce the throttle as the front end comes up to the balance point.
8. Cover the rear brake.
9. Stay on the throttle as it comes back down.

Balancing the wheelie from front to back
Balancing front to back is controlled by using the throttle and rear brake. It is a good idea to learn this on a quad, fiddy, or dirtbike first. If the wheelie is in front of the balance point, you must increase your speed to remain at that position. To get the wheelie back to the balance point, you must compensate with more throttle. This is the same, only in reverse, when the wheelie is behind the balance point. When behind the balance point, you must use the engine breaking/ rear brake to bring it forward to the balance point. The balance point is the position of the bike in which it neither has to speed up or slow down to remain at the same position. The height of the balance point is affected mainly by the speed of the wheelie. The faster the wheelie is, the lower the balance point. The balance point is also slightly affected by the weight distribution of the bike and the position of the rider. The object of riding a balanced wheelie is to keep the bike as close as possible to the balance point. This is done by rolling on and off the throttle, and pushing the brake if needed. With practice comes the ability to ride a smooth wheelie with out playing with the throttle/brake much.

Balancing the wheelie from side to side
Balancing sided to side is done by adjusting your body position. It is a good idea to learn this on a dirtbike, bicycle, or fiddy first. When riding wheelies over about 20mph, the bike will balance itself for the most part. It is the slow wheelies that you have to consciously balance side to side. The principle is pretty simple. Quickly lean the same direction as the bike is falling. For example, if the bike is starting to fall to the left, you would quickly lean to the left. This movement would twist the bike towards the left, thereby correcting it.

Preventing / stopping wheelie wobbles
From my experience, I think that high speed wheelie wobbles can be caused by having a squared off rear tire, not being smooth on the throttle, and/or making quick movements. Slow speed wobbles seems to be caused by high rear tire pressure, and/or not keeping the wheelie balanced from side to side.

Steering wheelies
To steer wheelies good, you need to either be at the balance point, or behind the balance point. To steer wheelies which are over about 20mph, you simply slowly lean in the direction you want to turn. However, to turn slow wheelies, you must first make the bike lean in the direction which you want to turn. For example, if you want to turn to the right, first, slowly lean to the right. Then quickly lean a little to the left / twist the handlebars a little to the left. This will cause the bike to start to fall to the right. Then, instead of completely correcting the lean, you keep the bike leaning at that angle. This will cause the bike to turn to the right.

Using the rear brake: Slowing wheelies down / 12s
Wheelies are slowed down by riding the wheelie behind the balance point. This is one of the hardest parts of learning to wheelie, not because of skill, but because of the balls required. To learn how to use the rear brake, you basically need to grow some balls, bring the wheelie up behind the balance point, and tap the brake. Soon this process will become second nature. To slow a wheelie down, you must give the bike enough throttle to get the wheelie behind the balance point. Now if you get scared and push the rear break hard at this point, it will quickly bring the wheelie forward without slowing it down much. To slow it down, you must keep it behind the balance point by gently riding the brake. To 12, you just do the same thing, only you get off the rear break enough to allow the bike to lean back on the tail. Unless you plan on parking a 12, make sure you get back on the brake before the wheelie slows down enough to stall the engine.

Riding slow wheelies
After you get good at slowing down wheelies, then you should be able to ride slow wheelies out. First of all, turn up your idle. I do slow stuff with the idle at 3.5k rpmÂ’s. The high idle allows you to ride slow wheelies much smoother. Be careful, however, when first turning up the idle, because you will have to use the rear brake, when going slow, to keep from looping. When riding slow wheelies with the idle high, with some practice, you should be able to ride the wheelie by using the brake, and only blipping the throttle if the wheelie starts to come down.

Once you have learned all of this, all of the wheelie variations will pretty much be self explanatory.



I donÂ’t care if you guys whore this information out on other websites. It would be nice to have some recognition for writing this, but I donÂ’t think I want my name attached to this for legal reasons.
If you know what you are talking about, post up suggestions regarding this post. I will be editing if there is better information/ tips for beginners. Feedback would be nice.[/QUOTE]
Thanks alot man its not everyday you get detailed facts on wheelies FOR BEGINNERS most people i asked just simply say open the throttle all the way and ride it out I really appreciate it.