Din

on a 2000 Gixxr 600? like how fast i should be going, what rpms i should be at, clucthin up? Also what the best tire pressure for the front and rear tires should be at when tryin to do this stunt? thanks.

RANGER

I have a 92 fzr 600 and I can do 2nd gear stand up's no prob. what i am saying is the power is there on the gixxer so all you have to do is stand up in a squatted possition with your rear end hovering over the passengers seat rev her and simultaniously bounce your pegs and bars to load the suspension as well as pulling the clutch in slightly just until it disengages and feather it out sharply as the suspension rebounding. body possition has a lot to do with the bike coming up. practice at slower speeds with your weight possitioned farther back and move your hips foreward as you near the balance point. on the gixxer 6 my friend has i can bounce, clutch it up in 3rd all day long. this actually has a real smooth feel when the bike is coming up but remember that the higher the speed the more unstable your bike will become. the aerodynamics of thes bikes were designed with two wheels on the ground. be careful but it takes nuts to rock it. also a smaller tooth sprocket in the front will help with a little more grunt down low.

Din

any other tips?

a56kuser

my gsxr is same as yours..... keep practicing your first gear wheelies
and then learn how to shift to second....... i made a long as post about shifting in a wheelie so read it..... just use the search button on shifting or something.

RANGER

Hey Din, here are a few more tips. first buy a front sprocket that is one tooth smaller than stock. this will give you more low end torque which will allow you to pull her up at lower rpm's and at lower speeds. Second lower the tire pressure in your back tire to about 25psi. this will allow better tire grip at lower speeds and will also help you keep the bike on a straighter path. The last guy told you to keep practicing first gear wheelies which is not bad advice but remember that first gear is very torqie and your chance of looping is greater. third find your balance point, once this is achieved you will know it, it just has a comfort feel and you will know you are there. when you are at the balance piont you will have to feather the throttle on and off to keep it there, subtle changes in your body possition will help you keep the wheelie up. lastly is shifting this can be accomplished by blipping the throttle to bring the front end a little more skyward, preload the shift lever, shut the throttle off threequarters of the way and powershift into third gear and regain your rpm's by quickly but smoothly rolling the throttle back on. Last but not least wear a helmet while your learning. I pick up my new shift red 04 R1 today!

NyTona

Ok, I have just started again, since the weather is beginning to break in Chicago. I've been trying to do these 2nd gear wheelies. Nada! Ok, well, I only started trying in October when the weather got cold, and now again while it is still cold, but anyway, enough of Chicago weather! I have a Triumph Daytona 955i. The thing 12 0'clocks in 1st easily! but I can't get the thing off the pavement in 2nd! I tried clutching it up in 2nd at 7rpms, it pulls, but doesn't get up. I want to do it without bouncing it. Also, I just read some new tips, like shifting without the clutch from 1st to 2nd, but any thing anyone can add would be Kool and the Gang!

melampus

I had a stock geared "01, and she bounced up best in second from between 45mph to 60mph (figure the revs out). Anything over that, and she'd come up too fast. Third gear she would bounce up best from 70mph to 80mph.

You later said you don't want to bounce her up... why? Regardless, I had never clutched up third, but second would clutch up (for me) only in between 8,250rpm and 9,500rpm... and only with a really strong rear weight bias.

Tires are preference, bro. Since you're learning though a lower pressure maybe somewhere in the range of 20-26psi will not only help make a flatter contact patch therefore helping you track a straighter line, but more importantly I think; is that the lower pressure in the front will help quell headshake if you land a little out of shape... TANKSLAPPERS SUCK If you end up in one through your travels, just pin it & hope the six has enough juice to bias the weight off the front end. Lastly, if you do have one, and pull out of it lightly tap your front brake to check for hydraulic pressure. Bad slappers can force the fluid right out of the calipers. Pump em, and they'll come back. If you don't check, and you lost pressure it could be potentially fatal as you wouldn't be able to stop when you needed to. Know what I mean!

Have fun... Be safe...

NyTona

[QUOTE=melampus]I had a stock geared "01, and she bounced up best in second from between 45mph to 60mph (figure the revs out). Anything over that, and she'd come up too fast. Third gear she would bounce up best from 70mph to 80mph.

You later said you don't want to bounce her up... why? Regardless, I had never clutched up third, but second would clutch up (for me) only in between 8,250rpm and 9,500rpm... and only with a really strong rear weight bias.


thanks for the safety tip on the tank slappers, never experienced one with my 1st gear wheelies and hope to never experience one. ok, to the bizness... I've got the 955i, and maybe it's just because I don't have the bounce technique down. I've seen a few guys do it and it just looks awkward. So, if you could give me some smooth tips, then I'll try it. The real deal is that I'm trying to do some freeway wheelies to keep up with traffic. My first gear wheelies shut down at around 50, so I'm experimenting with a few different ways. As I noted, the weather is just beginning to break, so I'll be out here trying to master it. (ahh, but today it is raining! )

eric_24

If your doing 12's you should be able to do a 2nd gear wheelie. and on a 955, you should be able to clutch,bounce , even power one up. bouncing is easy, just takes practice and timing to get right.

bobbo929

A friend of mine had a '02 gsxr 600 that we dropped one tooth in the front and when standing on the front pegs I still had to bounce it and clutch it.

melampus

If it looks awkward it's the rider. The fact remains is it all boils down to the rider. I can't just power up a second gear sit-down on a 600 (no on/off throttle application, no clutch), but I know there are plenty of people who can... any 600! From a 1994 to a 2004! It's all body position! Ever watch the elite wheelie standards from like 1985? It's all the rider. I know I can easily bounce up a 600 in third & have bounced them up in fourth on more then a few occassions, but I know there are others who can lift 4th like clockwork. Then there are those who complain about not being able to lift it in first. They blame everything and their mother, making up the most absurd excuses you could imagine. This is not directed at you NYTONA, but something I apparently needed to say. It is a rare pleasure to speak w/ someone like you who has a sincere interest in learning, and will listen w/an open mind instead of making excuses for what they haven't yet learned to master therefore dampening their abilty to excel.

Bear in mind too, I think I suck. I can't even highchair anything, yet. The difference though is that I don't ride outside of my limits just to do something someone else can, and what I can do I have a relatively easy time explaining to others because I understand the mechanics of it which is so important. I spend hours studying stunt DVDs of the elite. Watching body position, studying foot placement, noticing individual variations of the same trick by different people, etc. You HAVE to have a CLEAR picture in your mind of what to do before you do it, and more importantly what to do if it goes wrong. Always take BABY-STEPS, and try not to stunt frustrated. I mean just riding does so much for ones skill. Becoming at one with your bike requires seat time. When you become more comfortable you then expend less concentration on the basics of riding allowing you to focus more concentration on your new goal.

Excuse my venting please, and to get back to you and your question now. Think of a standing jump. If you are standing w/locked knees, and you try to start jumping you'll look awkward because you would typically be transmitting sharp inputs, and receiving sharp reactions from the surface you are standing making it difficult to find a rythym. On the other hand, if when you transition your weight downward to upward in concert with when you bend your knees to when you drive out of the bottom of your stroke you will jump rythmically as well as higher. Same on a bike, if you smoothly transition your weight to the ***** of your feet, smoothly drive through them forcing you back upward, then again smoothly transition back in a downward motion to the ***** of your feet, and drive back through them over and over you will begin a smooth rythmic "bounce"... child's play right!? Same concept on your bike. You are suspended in the between the shock & forks. Ride somewhere there are no cages, stand-up in second at 40-45mph, knees bent, and practice getting a slow rythmic bounce w/o accelerating at all. That's your goal. That's it.

Once you get a smooth rythym (you don't want to look like the awkward goofs you explain) then practice progressively bending your knees a little deeper when descending from the top of the bounce's stroke to when you are right before the bottom of said stroke. Then right before the bottom practice timing basically a jump driving all your weight and body firmly down into the pegs through the ***** of your feet directly into the middle of the resistance causing a deeper bounce and therfore a stronger reaction. If you time the extension of your legs w/ the ensuing ascending stroke you will be driving your body skyward as the bike is rebounding from you compressing the suspension.

Once you get that, then practice throttling hard just as the suspension is rebounding. If timed in concert with when you drive your body weight skyward by pushing firmly into the pegs the front tire WILL lift skyward as well. It just has to all be in concert which one gets with practice. When you get the actual lift down, then be ready to back off the throttle to a partial opening as you will loop otherwise.

Once you get the feel of when to let off the throttle and by how much as to not loop yet not drop the front back down you will begin to further your distance, and when you start riding them out for a while you will be getting all the closer to that revered "balance point" because to ride them further you will be becoming more comfortable in the position therfore expending less concentration on that step.

Then the next step is to practice entering that zone in which you feel like you are just about to loop as often as your ***** permit. Once you have the throttle control to bring yourself there on call you will begin to notice that your original feeling of an impending loop was simply your former inability to feather the throttle at a point in which you feel a type of weightlessness... and that would be the balance point buddy. A place where a hair too much throttle will have you hoping you know how to use your rear brake. Oops, I forgot you can already 12 your bike; so you've pretty much mastered metering the rear binder.

Once you get comfortable there, then practice holding it.

Once you can hold it; you can practice shifting, steering, transitioning and blah, blah, blah...

Hope I helped... Have fun... Wear gear please!

And just to quickly add, I think it makes most sense for a newbie to learn the "bounce" method first as there are less steps to confuse. Once the bounce is in rythym you just throttle it. Less stress on the scooter. A newbie practicing clutching it w/o experince w/proper body position & weight transfer is likely to smoke a clutch in a hurry. Once you get the "bounce" method down you have unknowingly learned how to transfer your weight correctly to hoist the front-end.

My

bill parr

not only will it fry a clutch in a hurry if you dont know what you are doing, it will loop ya even faster, clutchin is unpredictable.

NyTona

Man, thanks for the details!!!!
I appreciate this, much!
Thanks for taking the time out to walk me through it. The weather got cold again here on Sunday and Today, so when it warms up again, I'll be out. I definitely wear gear! Leathers, gloves and Helmet. With my wheelies, I have never laid the bike down. I hope to be able to say that with these 2nd gear ones!

I can do 1st gear stand ups off the clutch, and haven't had any problems. (I ride em until I red line it. So, I will be working on balance points on both first and second gear wheelies.

Like you, I watch the stunt videos and the World Domination 2 video, man, I watch the crashes over and over to make sure I don't do the same thing. I was trying to learn stoppies last year and almost laid the bike down! Adrenalin rush made me strong enough to catch it as it was tipping. After watching all those crashes with guys doing the stoppies, I have stopped! That was the one stunt that EVERYONE lays the bike down on. I like my bike too much. Not a scratch on it! I have just some basic goals: 2nd gear wheelies as you know, high chairs... after I master the 2nd gear, and now maybe a ballerina. That's about it.

I'll keep you posted on the progress! Thanks again! The perspective and the time you put into the response is well-received.
Ride safely! (as possible doing the stunts)

melampus

Gladly... That's one of the reasons I come to this board; to offer the help I never had.

Also you mention practicing 1st & 2nd gear balance points. I'd suggest mastering second gear first. Less twitchy. Once you can break a mile on one in second w/o accelerating at all you should probably be ready to start working on it in first.

NyTona

Finally! Chicago weather seems to have broken for good! (Yeah, but on Monday it was 35, but today was 75!) So, I was out for about an hour just practicing by myself the rhythmic bouncing. Tomorrow, I'll do it some more.
On one try, I did throttle and it lifted about only an inch or so. But when it came down the handle bars shook until I got it under control. Any suggestions. That caused me concern. Since I will be going fast and if only the inch up did that, If I don't get it up significantly with the throttle, I could be in bad shape.
THis is coming from a guy who has NEVER dropped the bike trying to wheely or do the first gear standups.
Also, how long did it take you to do the 2nd gear standups.
Just a guage for myself. I am taking baby steps. I do realize that 1st gears are comfortable to me now, but I remember the fear of GOD when I was trying them at first. So, now, I've got that with these 2nd gears with the bounce. I want the easy way! You know, just clutch it up in 2nd with the same effort as in 1st. Also with my sit down 2nds, it is the same thing with the "inch up" thing. Today I was trying to see if I could switch gears while going up in first, but no success. I got some tips on shifting but it just seems awkward. As you can tell, I am trying to easy and safely my way into those 2nd gear wheelies.

Also, have you ever dropped the bike doing endos? Today was my first day also fooling around with those. Man, that fear that I had with the first gears, now I have with those endos. I didn't "roll 'em out" I just was baby stepping it there as well. I have got to stop watching STUNT VIDEOS! (like you I watch the crash scenes over and over and over again so I don't end up in the ER or worse) The problem is that I am addicted to the stuff and the challenge of getting better. I do know my limits, though.
Any insight is helpful!

evolrider

Hey man, I got the same bike pretty much. A '03 Sixxer, stock everything. All these guys have a wealth of knowledge. Start in 2nd, stand up towards the back, throttle on off a couple times, until its around 10k rpm on the last throttle off bounce it, then gun the **** out of it. I will lift. It might be a little scary a first but youll get em in no time. :YEAH

Quik

it looks like alot of ppl suggest doing 2nd gear instead of first. i got a 96f3 with full pipe and jetting and advancer os it got some power. it has -1,+3 gearing. i let my buddy pull it up in 2nd no problem at all. he rides a 02 r1. he even said it supprised him for being a f3. now i got it up in first on/off/on about a foot. second gear i try bouncing on the pegs and giving gas [only tried a few times] best i can do is an inch. i went to the dragstrip the other day and i started to come up at end of first, came up in second and then third. each time only a few inches. enought when it came down it shooked bad. which hurt my time. but anyways. would all these pointers help me out the same as anyone else. and if anyone is in the burgh who would like to show me how to stunt. i got hte twisties pretty good just need to air it up now


thanks in advance

xRR-riderx

Hey Rookie96F3, how is that -1/+3 for just everyday riding? i got -1 right now on my f3, but i have a +3 rear sitting in my car right now, waiting to be put on, along witha RK 530 x-link o-ring. im wondering if my -1 is good enough, but i am having trouble getting it up in 2nd, and this would probably help. let me know how that is for daily riding. by the way, im from Bethel Park in pittsburgh too. were always up south park, and down at Schenley park, if u wanna ride...

Quik

that sounds good. i really like my gearing. in the twisties it really is sweet. as far as low end its nice. i dont ride much in first way to torquey. the kid who got my bike up in second all he did was bounce it. came right even on a hill. with that gearing im still able to top out at 140mph at 14k rpms. yes my speedo is correct. it runs off the wheel.[dont ask long story] yea ill ride just hit me up. Also check out WWW.goldentriangleriders.com they are from the burgh. im on that site also. they usually meet up at Mount Washington.

melampus

#1 >> You are getting head-shake [that which would undoubtedly be a full-on tankslapper if you had any height in your wheelie] because you are setting the wheel down slightly cocked to one side which is undoubtedly happening due to you pulling too hard on the clip-ons. Remember, you are not pulling up the front-end with your arms; the engine is motoring it up. You need not YANK on the clip-ons, it's more a fluid pull that is in time with the bike that is coming up on its own. The actual pulling force is not that great. When you get into the habit of harsh inputs, I ASSURE YOU THAT YOUR BIKE WILL REWARD YOU WITH HARSH FEEDBACK. Luckily this time it was not enough to cause you a wreck. Try to slow your mind a little, and focus on fluidity. Everything has to be SMOOTH.

#2 >> Bear in mind that I have been riding street & dirt on & off for 13 years now so how long it took me to do something may not be the best bar to measure from, but to answer... after 2 or 3 tries I had lifted the front-end to my chest, and that was only because I was figuring where in the rev range she reacted best. At the time I was too high (10-11K), and she was lifting QUICK... slapping me in the chest. I ended up off the throttle leaning with my head up over the head-light to keep her from looping the first few times. I figure you would rather err on your side at this point. Point in case though is that in ten minutes I was riding stand-ups in second, acclimating to the feeling and getting my balance. Within a week or two I was riding them out to shift-point in second, shifting into third, riding to shift-point, shifting into fourth when I could (I noticed if I rode 3rd all the way out, 4th didn't have enough power to keep her up so I learned to short-shift 4th by 1-2k rpm to keep my 600 up). All of which I could already do in sit-downs. From there it probably took me 3-5 weeks to get balance point down to where it was my fore-arms that gave way before my balance. :YEAH

#3 >> You mention "the easy way" like in 1st. You will see that clutching in 1st & 2nd is just as easy. It is just that in second on a 600 body position is CRUCIAL. If your nuts are in the tank, both tires stay planted... if your *** is touching the rear seat, you're on a 100hp uni-cycle. Yah, you have to be more in touch w/your bike's powerband so as to slip the clutch in the right rev range, but it's body position that makes or breaks its ease.

#4 >> Shifting gears is just that man, shifting gears. You need to be more comfortable in the wheelie itself if you are too uncomfortable to shift. You are expending too much concentration on not wrecking so you have none to afford on shifting. Realize that when you shift into second if you reapply the same amount of throttle you had previous to the shift YOU WILL LOOP. When you are in a 1st gear wheelie once you get to shift-point, say 11k on a Jap 600, lightly preload the shifter, blip off the throttle, snick a shift into second and then open the throttle back partially. Just as you would while shifting when riding, just w/o as much throttle. Cover the rear brake, and be ready to close the throttle if she lifts too much. Most probably you won't give her enough throttle on the shift because of your nerves and she will drop... that's fine. Err on the safe side. Just keep increasing throttle until you keep the wheelie up. Then 3rd will be there quicker then you know!

#5 >> I have been rolling stoppies for 15 months, and have never dropped one (knock on wood). I have been at the point where I thought I was going over more times then I'd care to remember, but thankfully have not. I have been straight up & down, pulling back my weight w/all my might, transitioned into a no-footer (not to do it, just to lean back more) suspended in a feeling that went beyond weightlessness (if BP wheelies are weightlessness, this was molecular suspension) but didn't drop it. I have had big headshake in the midst of 40mph stoppies, but dropped her rear in time to recover. I have got just WAY TOO SIDEWAYS while the rear drifts mid-stoppie, but have always dropped the rear in time to recover. Actually in that regard, I once saw the boys of GEARED-UP on I-95 coming back from MOROSO, and this was what was said... https://www.stuntlife.com/forums/23-triple-xtreme/40349-triplexxxtreme-trailer-i-95-a.html I love stoppies! About a month ago I started one-handers. I'm only good for four car-lengths right now though.

Have fun... Be safe...