excessa

It's a good idea to really consider what your biggest rider safety concerns are, and what the crowd safety concerns are constantly.

insurers are looking for active safety consciousness and established solid safety protocols in an adrenaline sport right now. and insurers sort of underhandedly dictate who the venues can have performing or competing.

the monster trucks have just cost an insurance company or two a gigantic ton of money.


good luck all of you, I can see a strong industry taking shape around your sport, and it's really cool.

Valeska

Jeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeezzzzus people! Will all the blabbering skeptics please take a few minutes to either use their noggins, or if all else fails, go READ the product info before voicing your disbelief in its need, function & effectiveness?

For one, do you not think that everything from scientists to engineers to product developers and on down the line all did some pretty thorough research & testing in developing this product before it was produced & packaged? Did you consider that not only do all those people know wayyyy more than you, but so do the people who deemed it beneficial & now mandatory for obviously justifiable & valid reasons in arenas such as pro MX as mentioned?
Stop calling for the original poster to provide you with all the research, stats & proof that you demand, and DO IT YOURSELF lazy asses! =p Sheesh.
Read/research/think, THEN speak, 'kay?

VerticalLimits

No one is doubting it's a good product, just that they don't feel there's a need for it to be mandatory. Now a guard for your hands to stay out of the sprocket and chain seems like a more legitimate battle.

Valeska

Yeah a few skeptics were indeed doubting that. But I def +1 the chain guard!! GOOD point! We all know of at least several people who have had serious injuries from that.

Tony L

the arai's have something like that that removes the whole shell and inner liner i dont know enough about it to tell you the differences tho....

I'm guessing you have a problem with the fact that you have to wear mandatory jackets and jeans during a comp as well.... I'd rather have a better chance of walking than not having a small non obtrusive product that could save my life or the use of my body again if the ama uses it... Pastrana uses it, irl drivers use it the proof is in the support. obviously if its mandatory chances are the event will get a break on the cost of the product and be able to provide it to the riders. I'm sure a sponsor would have no problem supplying the xdl with the funds to purchase a bulk amount for all the competitors to promote safety in action sports. go behind the scenes of the dew tour or xgames our industry looks like a joke compared to the safety precautions they take and do you really think the AMA (American Motorcycle Association) would back a product that hasn't been tested?

it should be good for the life of the helmet

M Jones

Sick. Love you Tony

2 Vicious Freestyle

I have just one question,

Are u sponsored by this company tony??

2 Vicious Freestyle

/\

that post was not suppose to sound negative, so don't take it that way

2 Vicious Freestyle

and also, while on this subject, along with arai, the new scorpion EXO 700 series helmets have adjustable air filled cheek pads, and a release valve so in the event of an accident, EMT's can pop the release valve and deflate the cheek pads

excessa

Good innovations. I regret the injuries to my spine the most. (two bone grafts on my neck, eight screws and two titanium plates)

GAMstunts

I have no problems with jacket + jeans because i have tested their usefullness myself (many times over and over). I have a problem when I got someone telling me I gotta buy one to compete. You guys are acting like this things the second coming of christ. If your that bent on safety why not pad all the walls around every event.

I dont feel theres enough need or enough incidents that this product would be a lifesaver to make it "mandatory". And, for what it is $60 is pricey regardless of what it "claims" to do. An ounce of sugar will save a diabetics life but I wouldnt charge him $100 for it.

Also Im sure plenty of people are making money on this product (which is fine i appreciate capitolism) but I have my opinion on it, and without at least one example where someone walked after using this product im not spending my change on it.

If someone gives me one for free, I will def give it a try or wear it in competition, just dont require me to overpay for one.

Tony L

Here's your example numerous riders have been taken off the track with head and neck injuries the hats off or shock doctor device was used in the removal of the helmet... the riders are still walking today.... who knows if it helped but wouldn't you want just that added chance that you could walk for the rest of your life? and if you want to talk capitalism check the dealer markup on your jacket, gloves, jeans and helmet......

yes now... but i purchased these at full retail before i ever got an ounce of product.... I'm standing behind this because i truly believe it could help keep myself of someone out of a wheelchair... i hope i never have to use it but its there if they need to. as for the scorpion and arai you still have to pull the helmet off the head the hats off device separates both without putting strain or pressure on the neck.

GAMstunts

[quote=Tony L;3757143]Here's your example numerous riders have been taken off the track with head and neck injuries the hats off or shock doctor device was used in the removal of the helmet... the riders are still walking today.... who knows if it helped but wouldn't you want just that added chance that you could walk for the rest of your life? and if you want to talk capitalism check the dealer markup on your jacket, gloves, jeans and helmet......
quote]

Honestly man, I know it sounds like im tryin to give you a hard time but trust me, im not. My only beef is with people trying to make it mandatory when riders gotta buy it. Personally I dont go to very many competitions, I do mostly shows. I also make enough money to easily afford one of these. not my issue, but you yourself state in your third sentence and I quote; "who knows if it helped but ....." thats the problem im havin with making it mandatory is the "who knows" and with all the rules and regulations i got to live with already i really dont want another one over "who knows" and a salesman making a good pitch. If You prove itll lower insurance costs for events, or make it much cheaper, im all in. Other than that, its a good idea but I dont believe it should be mandatory safety equiptment for stunters. If your jumpin hundreds of feet in the air or goin 200+ is a different story. I just may be ignorant or just have not heard of anyone at any comp or show getting paralized or having serious neck trauma (unlike MX or bike/car racing)

2 Vicious Freestyle

I'm not hating, just asking bro... I don't think this is a bad idea, but i don't think it should be mandatory at a comp... Now if these things blow up and damn near every helmet on the road had one, and every ambulance had a pump on hand i'd say its a great idea... But basically the only place this thing would benefit would be at an event where the EMT's are familiar with the product. this thing ain't gonna do jack **** for me when i'm out at the spot bustin out 90mph HC coasters (hey a guy can dream can't he) and get launched off the bike, get all balld up n knock myself out, cuz the EMT's that come to scrape my *** up won't have onea the pumps and have no idea what the hell this little hose on my helmet is for..... yah know what i'm sayin

DrasticDan

I like the idea of that!

Tony L

i do mostly shows but i'm still the guy who looks at a product that could insure the fact that i'll walk for the rest of my life. you dont see me bitching about the 100.00 i spent this past month on 2 units? reason being is i'll support a product that is a proven and backed product i've been about numerous ama supercross and outdoor races and seen james stewart on a back board 3 times and every time they have removed his helmet with this device. you got a guy like pastrana who is jumping out of airplanes with a parachute using it in every one of his helmets. I flipped a stoppie a few years back and destroyed almost every bone in my back - my spine if i would have hit just a different way and my spine would have shifted it would have killed me instantly... hence why i'll take the chance spend the 100.00 and survive to hang with my son for a few more years.

so your telling me if you were at stuntwars or xdl riding with your wife and god forbid something happens when the bike or you looses control that you wouldn't want to improve the chance that you may save her life in the event of a catastrophic wreck? this is just like health insurance we don't want to use it but when we have to we welcome it.

excessa

If back protectors aren't already mandatory, then this one is moot until you get to that point.

I also don't know if this particular product should be mandatory, but I do know the biggest venues are looking for hard, supported (by science or statistics) safety protocols and thought I'd pass that along.

Insurers are changing their standards to reflect how much they like spending money on dead people.


"sure we'll insure this event, as long as they have 40 foot nets, airwalls, brand new vehicles, santa claus, a six story hospital next door, and numerous woodland elves in attendance..."

"can it be seven stories?"

"no, has to be six"

more close to what really is happening to other people in another sport: a risk mitigation expert representing the insurer can come to a show at one of their client venues, decide it's a bad risk, and write what he wants to see enforced as your safety standards at their venues. at that point you're usually pretty fucked trying to get a gig at that venue again.

2 Vicious Freestyle

no no no, I understand where you are comming from, but what i'm sayin is for the maybe couple comps we are gonna go to this year this may pay off, but EVERYDAY when we are out at the spot, this thing isn't gonna help at all

Valeska

Is there any reason why these devices could not be kept on hand at the events and put into the competitors helmets before their run, and re-used so long as they weren't deployed?

excessa

that's a good question. It's hard enough on the guys who are paying to play, and the riders ability to conform to the standard needs to be taken into account.

this aint a safe sport, so it's hard to define "safe enough". I wish you guys luck and hope you never have to deal with another industry defining what standards they will accept from you, leveraging larger audiences.