stunting oil?
05-07-2003, 10:09 PM
#3
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Actually, I would recommend Mobil1 15w50. It's the only Mobil1 without a friction modifier. Friction modifiers make the clutch slip. The 15w50 is the only Mobil1 with a red cap. And yes, it's synthetic -- Mobil1 only makes synthetic, so it's redundant to say Mobil1 synthetic.
Wal-mart carries a 5 quart container for $18.
Don't waste your money on "motorcycle" oil. It's all hype and does nothing special. There have been independant oil tests done that show that Mobil1 products come out on top, or very near the top, of oils.
The reason you want synthetic? It holds up better to abuse. Race bikes are abused... do they run dino oil? Hell no!
See, since your motor AND tranny share the same lube source, unlike a car, it has to take the beating of the motor and gearbox. The meshing of the gears as well as the clutch plates sliding together create a tremendous sheering action. Since synthetic apparently has smaller polymer strands, it should be able to hold up to the sheering action better. Think of it like this... drop some tree branches into a foilage shredder. What's going to come out? Lots of little pieces. Now, drop a bunch of crumbled up leaves into the shredder. What's going to happen? It's not going to get mangled as much. This is really a bad analogy, but I think it conveys the point.
Also, an oil filter is an oil filter is an oil filter IS NOT TRUE. Many lower end filters have absolutely MISERABLE filtration media... basically **** that's paper/cardboard type material. Similarly, they might not flow oil very well. Similarly, they might not have as much surface area. Don't worry about buying the oil filter from the dealer -- find the appropriate Mobil1 filter. It costs the same or $1 less than an OEM filter, but you can believe it works better. The filtration media is synthetic and does VERY well. If you really want to spend money, get a Scott oil filter -- it's reusable, does a good job, you can inspect it for flakes of metal, but it's like $80. Avoid Fram like the plague. The Purolator Pure filters are also decent buys. Just as an aside, I know that the Mobil1 filter that fits the 99-02 R6 is the same filter that fits the Mazda MX-3 V6.
NOTE: not ALL filters for a car that has the same size filter as your bike will work! There are some filters for the MX-3 V6 that WILL NOT WORK on the 99-02 R6. Check into it first.
I think I can keep going on and on. The fact is, oil is a religion. Do whatever your personal religion tells you to do. But at least determine your religion based on good facts.
But most important is to regularly change your oil and filter. Learn what old oil tastes like. It's seriously the easiest way to determine if you need new oil. I'm not joking.
---edit---
Also, DO NOT dump half a quart extra in. I guess the mentaility of this is that when you're doing wheelies, it will be easier for the pickup to get oil to feed the motor. This might be true, but you're actually risking more harm than good! Too much oil = too much oil pressure. It WILL find it's way out in the form of blown gaskets and seals. Fill your bike up to the 'full' mark. Maybe 1/4 a quart/liter extra.. but 1/2 is just too much.
Wal-mart carries a 5 quart container for $18.
Don't waste your money on "motorcycle" oil. It's all hype and does nothing special. There have been independant oil tests done that show that Mobil1 products come out on top, or very near the top, of oils.
The reason you want synthetic? It holds up better to abuse. Race bikes are abused... do they run dino oil? Hell no!
See, since your motor AND tranny share the same lube source, unlike a car, it has to take the beating of the motor and gearbox. The meshing of the gears as well as the clutch plates sliding together create a tremendous sheering action. Since synthetic apparently has smaller polymer strands, it should be able to hold up to the sheering action better. Think of it like this... drop some tree branches into a foilage shredder. What's going to come out? Lots of little pieces. Now, drop a bunch of crumbled up leaves into the shredder. What's going to happen? It's not going to get mangled as much. This is really a bad analogy, but I think it conveys the point.
Also, an oil filter is an oil filter is an oil filter IS NOT TRUE. Many lower end filters have absolutely MISERABLE filtration media... basically **** that's paper/cardboard type material. Similarly, they might not flow oil very well. Similarly, they might not have as much surface area. Don't worry about buying the oil filter from the dealer -- find the appropriate Mobil1 filter. It costs the same or $1 less than an OEM filter, but you can believe it works better. The filtration media is synthetic and does VERY well. If you really want to spend money, get a Scott oil filter -- it's reusable, does a good job, you can inspect it for flakes of metal, but it's like $80. Avoid Fram like the plague. The Purolator Pure filters are also decent buys. Just as an aside, I know that the Mobil1 filter that fits the 99-02 R6 is the same filter that fits the Mazda MX-3 V6.
NOTE: not ALL filters for a car that has the same size filter as your bike will work! There are some filters for the MX-3 V6 that WILL NOT WORK on the 99-02 R6. Check into it first.
I think I can keep going on and on. The fact is, oil is a religion. Do whatever your personal religion tells you to do. But at least determine your religion based on good facts.
But most important is to regularly change your oil and filter. Learn what old oil tastes like. It's seriously the easiest way to determine if you need new oil. I'm not joking.
---edit---
Also, DO NOT dump half a quart extra in. I guess the mentaility of this is that when you're doing wheelies, it will be easier for the pickup to get oil to feed the motor. This might be true, but you're actually risking more harm than good! Too much oil = too much oil pressure. It WILL find it's way out in the form of blown gaskets and seals. Fill your bike up to the 'full' mark. Maybe 1/4 a quart/liter extra.. but 1/2 is just too much.
Last edited by smb123; 05-07-2003 at 10:14 PM.
05-08-2003, 01:48 AM
#4
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Location: Jacksonville, FL
Age: 46
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90w gear lube and a bottle of STP Smoke Treatement......
Seriously, I run the same stuff he's talking about, and he's not kidding about running too much oil in it. It'll hurt far more than help. Apart from the worst case of it, too much oil pressure, it will also hurt your performance, and cause way too much stress on the bearings and rotating parts. Gotta realize, at the bottom and the top of ever engine stroke, all the inertia going down or up gets reverted to going the other way. ANYTHING that is in the way, or impedes this process will cause bad effects elsewhere. Too much oil can also be up on the bottom of the crankshaft, and in where the connecting rod is, having the same effect of trying to spin a trailer jack half in-half out of the water. Also causes oil to be sprayed and atomized everywhere, and get on other parts and pieces it shouldn't be sitting so heavily on. There's a reason there's a low/high oil level mark. On cars it's called a windage tray. On Bikes, I'm not sure, but it's a series of baffles that keeps the crankshaft from splashing in the oil. Also, since the transmission is in the rear of the bike, another 1/2 quart of oil isn't going to do much to get the oil to the pickup. MOST motorcycles have oil pickups where they will pickup oil in the far rear of the pan. Reason being is oil is a thick liquid, hard acceleration, (which is what sportbikes are built for) causes the oil to be pushed to the rear of the sump. In racing applications, oil will be pushed to the rear of the sump, then the front, then the rear, then the front. Because of this, all the oil is either scavenged from the front and the rear of the engine througha series of galleys cut in the block, or there are more than one oil pickup. Do some research on your bike, find out where and how it scavenges oil. If it doesn't scavenge from far enough back, order some longer pickups, or have some made. At most it'll cost you $200.00 to have a set of pickups custom made, and it's far cheaper than an engine rebuild, or an engine replacement.
SMB123: Is the oil filter you're talking about kind of like an Olberg, or does it actually filter the oil, not just let you see what's inside it?
Seriously, I run the same stuff he's talking about, and he's not kidding about running too much oil in it. It'll hurt far more than help. Apart from the worst case of it, too much oil pressure, it will also hurt your performance, and cause way too much stress on the bearings and rotating parts. Gotta realize, at the bottom and the top of ever engine stroke, all the inertia going down or up gets reverted to going the other way. ANYTHING that is in the way, or impedes this process will cause bad effects elsewhere. Too much oil can also be up on the bottom of the crankshaft, and in where the connecting rod is, having the same effect of trying to spin a trailer jack half in-half out of the water. Also causes oil to be sprayed and atomized everywhere, and get on other parts and pieces it shouldn't be sitting so heavily on. There's a reason there's a low/high oil level mark. On cars it's called a windage tray. On Bikes, I'm not sure, but it's a series of baffles that keeps the crankshaft from splashing in the oil. Also, since the transmission is in the rear of the bike, another 1/2 quart of oil isn't going to do much to get the oil to the pickup. MOST motorcycles have oil pickups where they will pickup oil in the far rear of the pan. Reason being is oil is a thick liquid, hard acceleration, (which is what sportbikes are built for) causes the oil to be pushed to the rear of the sump. In racing applications, oil will be pushed to the rear of the sump, then the front, then the rear, then the front. Because of this, all the oil is either scavenged from the front and the rear of the engine througha series of galleys cut in the block, or there are more than one oil pickup. Do some research on your bike, find out where and how it scavenges oil. If it doesn't scavenge from far enough back, order some longer pickups, or have some made. At most it'll cost you $200.00 to have a set of pickups custom made, and it's far cheaper than an engine rebuild, or an engine replacement.
SMB123: Is the oil filter you're talking about kind of like an Olberg, or does it actually filter the oil, not just let you see what's inside it?
05-08-2003, 11:41 AM
#6
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Ok, I got somethin for you smb123! Quick question. I dunno how much you know about the gixxers. But are you familiar with the pair mod? Doing the pair mod puts a vacuum in the crank case. So, does running a 1/2 quart over have any effect on oil pressure then? I wouldnt think so, but I could be wrong.
05-08-2003, 11:45 AM
#7
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I would also like to add that like smb123 said, FRAM FILTERS SUCK! Dont buy them! They have cardboard filters that are known to come apart inside your engine and blow it up.. Also, a couple years back they were exploding which would blow oil all over your tires at speed!
05-08-2003, 12:41 PM
#8
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Originally posted by doc_rock
SMB123: Is the oil filter you're talking about kind of like an Olberg, or does it actually filter the oil, not just let you see what's inside it?
SMB123: Is the oil filter you're talking about kind of like an Olberg, or does it actually filter the oil, not just let you see what's inside it?
CBROrange:
So if you throw an extra 1/2 quart in, how is your pickup going to get this? All your oil is still going to shift location... 1/2 quart will just make non 12 o'clock riding have way too much oil pressure!
Originally posted by setuid
Ok, I got somethin for you smb123! Quick question. I dunno how much you know about the gixxers. But are you familiar with the pair mod? Doing the pair mod puts a vacuum in the crank case. So, does running a 1/2 quart over have any effect on oil pressure then? I wouldnt think so, but I could be wrong.
Ok, I got somethin for you smb123! Quick question. I dunno how much you know about the gixxers. But are you familiar with the pair mod? Doing the pair mod puts a vacuum in the crank case. So, does running a 1/2 quart over have any effect on oil pressure then? I wouldnt think so, but I could be wrong.
I don't see how this would have any effect on oil pressure. 1/2 over is still a bad idea IMHO. Maybe as Doc_Rock suggested, look into relocating your pickup at the back of the oil pan. As far as I knew, the 900, 929, possibly 954 had their pickups in the back -- one of the reasons they were good bikes to wheelie without worrying too much about lunching the motor. I know the Ducati 749 and 999 have their pickups back there
05-08-2003, 01:15 PM
#9
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smb123 knows whats up. Don't ever put in to much oil, unless you want your bike to run like **** and break.
For the people that put in 1/2 a quart extra, keep your bad advice to yourself, you are going to cause some dumb *** to go home and break his ****.
For the people that put in 1/2 a quart extra, keep your bad advice to yourself, you are going to cause some dumb *** to go home and break his ****.
05-08-2003, 01:23 PM
#11
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Location: Whoresville, CA
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Originally posted by smb123
It's an actual oil filter. http://www.scottsperformance.com/pro...php?PartType=3
CBROrange:
So if you throw an extra 1/2 quart in, how is your pickup going to get this? All your oil is still going to shift location... 1/2 quart will just make non 12 o'clock riding have way too much oil pressure!
Ok, I'm guessing the PAIR mod is something along the lines of a positive crankcase vent, but where it actually SUCKS the positive crankcase hot oil air out instead of letting it come out on it's own? At least basedon your description.
I don't see how this would have any effect on oil pressure. 1/2 over is still a bad idea IMHO. Maybe as Doc_Rock suggested, look into relocating your pickup at the back of the oil pan. As far as I knew, the 900, 929, possibly 954 had their pickups in the back -- one of the reasons they were good bikes to wheelie without worrying too much about lunching the motor. I know the Ducati 749 and 999 have their pickups back there
It's an actual oil filter. http://www.scottsperformance.com/pro...php?PartType=3
CBROrange:
So if you throw an extra 1/2 quart in, how is your pickup going to get this? All your oil is still going to shift location... 1/2 quart will just make non 12 o'clock riding have way too much oil pressure!
Ok, I'm guessing the PAIR mod is something along the lines of a positive crankcase vent, but where it actually SUCKS the positive crankcase hot oil air out instead of letting it come out on it's own? At least basedon your description.
I don't see how this would have any effect on oil pressure. 1/2 over is still a bad idea IMHO. Maybe as Doc_Rock suggested, look into relocating your pickup at the back of the oil pan. As far as I knew, the 900, 929, possibly 954 had their pickups in the back -- one of the reasons they were good bikes to wheelie without worrying too much about lunching the motor. I know the Ducati 749 and 999 have their pickups back there
05-08-2003, 02:24 PM
#12
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Hrmm.. I am not trying to argue, cause I am no expert. But if you do the PAIR mod which creates a vacuum on the crank case... Negative pressure in the crank case... How can that NOT affect oil pressure? If you do a search on the pair mod on gixxer.com, you will read about all kinds of people freakin out because their oil pressure light comes on after performing the PAIR mod. I am just wondering.. Maybe I should be asking this over there.
Dont get me wrong, I agree that modifying the oil pickup is the correct way to fix the problem I am just curious.
Dont get me wrong, I agree that modifying the oil pickup is the correct way to fix the problem I am just curious.
05-08-2003, 04:10 PM
#13
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piece of **** hondas?!?!?!?!
is that why everybody stunts them???
nonamestunta...you need to get your facts straight man...
kevin from starboyz told me in person that he runs his gsxr and their RR's 1/2 a quart over at all times.....
is that why everybody stunts them???
nonamestunta...you need to get your facts straight man...
kevin from starboyz told me in person that he runs his gsxr and their RR's 1/2 a quart over at all times.....
05-08-2003, 04:23 PM
#14
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: San Diego, CA
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15/50 synthetic?? Are you talking about 15 50 synthetic car oil? If youre talking about car oil, then I have no problem on oil changes anymore. hahaha I work at an oil shop, and I also have a 2000 r6, if the mx3 v6 oil filter fits then damn, I have both the oil and filter here. let me know if youre talking about car oil. asap!
05-08-2003, 04:34 PM
#15
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I can't believe this topic caused so much controversy. I personally have seen bikes blow up doing wheelies, and the person said they had the oil right on the mark. I put 25,000 miles on mine without any problems- I always used castrol and added like an extra 1/2 quart. The whole time I ride the bike it is at 12:00, so needless to say I will keep on adding extra oil, regardless of what these people say- To me this is the right way (historically speaking). Just thought I would add some input. Oh- by the way if hondas are such crap why are 90% of the bikes at any stunt show 900rr's- you've probably never riden one.
05-08-2003, 04:50 PM
#16
www.krazywhiteboys.com
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Originally posted by setuid
Ok, I got somethin for you smb123! Quick question. I dunno how much you know about the gixxers. But are you familiar with the pair mod? Doing the pair mod puts a vacuum in the crank case. So, does running a 1/2 quart over have any effect on oil pressure then? I wouldnt think so, but I could be wrong.
Ok, I got somethin for you smb123! Quick question. I dunno how much you know about the gixxers. But are you familiar with the pair mod? Doing the pair mod puts a vacuum in the crank case. So, does running a 1/2 quart over have any effect on oil pressure then? I wouldnt think so, but I could be wrong.
Laterz, KW Rich
05-08-2003, 05:10 PM
#17
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Whoresville, CA
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Originally posted by setuid
Hrmm.. I am not trying to argue, cause I am no expert. But if you do the PAIR mod which creates a vacuum on the crank case... Negative pressure in the crank case... How can that NOT affect oil pressure? If you do a search on the pair mod on gixxer.com, you will read about all kinds of people freakin out because their oil pressure light comes on after performing the PAIR mod. I am just wondering.. Maybe I should be asking this over there.
Dont get me wrong, I agree that modifying the oil pickup is the correct way to fix the problem I am just curious.
Hrmm.. I am not trying to argue, cause I am no expert. But if you do the PAIR mod which creates a vacuum on the crank case... Negative pressure in the crank case... How can that NOT affect oil pressure? If you do a search on the pair mod on gixxer.com, you will read about all kinds of people freakin out because their oil pressure light comes on after performing the PAIR mod. I am just wondering.. Maybe I should be asking this over there.
Dont get me wrong, I agree that modifying the oil pickup is the correct way to fix the problem I am just curious.
Originally posted by KrazyWhite Rich
Hey bro....what's the pair mod? I have a gixxer and it sounds like I need to do this to my bike.
Laterz, KW Rich
Hey bro....what's the pair mod? I have a gixxer and it sounds like I need to do this to my bike.
Laterz, KW Rich
05-08-2003, 05:14 PM
#18
www.Redline-Xtreme.com
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Tampa, FL
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Originally posted by NoNameStunter
smb123 knows whats up. Don't ever put in to much oil, unless you want your bike to run like **** and break.
For the people that put in 1/2 a quart extra, keep your bad advice to yourself, you are going to cause some dumb *** to go home and break his ****.
smb123 knows whats up. Don't ever put in to much oil, unless you want your bike to run like **** and break.
For the people that put in 1/2 a quart extra, keep your bad advice to yourself, you are going to cause some dumb *** to go home and break his ****. 
. As long as I have been riding I have always used 1/2qt more oil than the manufactures recommended amount. Guess what....no engine problems. I will continue to do so as I have been told by many credible riders and mechanics.If your new advice is true...thanks, but I guess I will just have to find out the hard way. As far as it being "BAD ADVISE"...put some "One Wheel" miles on your bike and then come back here with your Great Advice
!
05-08-2003, 05:50 PM
#20
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Redline Jimmy, not trying to make enemies, but I will speak my piece where it needs to be spoken. I guess that you are implying that since you ride for a team and you don’t know who I am that I don’t have any experience with bikes. You need to keep your ego to yourself, because if I had a bike and tore it up because a big name stunter like redlinejimmy gave me some sh!ty advice I would be mighty pissed off.
Like I said I have a 00 gxsr and my experience is to much oil, no good, the right amount of oil, good.
Maybe with the older style gxsr like, the one in your avatar, 1/2 a quart extra is the way to roll. I know for a fact 2000 and up gxsr 1/2 a quart extra is not the way to roll.
Like I said I have a 00 gxsr and my experience is to much oil, no good, the right amount of oil, good.
Maybe with the older style gxsr like, the one in your avatar, 1/2 a quart extra is the way to roll. I know for a fact 2000 and up gxsr 1/2 a quart extra is not the way to roll.
